FWB65 (& 80) Q re cocking behavior

[BarrelRider]

Question for the Feinwerkbau cognescenti -

Is it normal, or within range of normal function, for the sledge/action to intermittently unlock during the cocking sequence?

For example - after firing, I nudge the sledge/action forward so it locks in battery, then pull the cocking lever back to cock and reload. When the cocking lever is near the 90 degree mark (perpendicular to the bore) the often sledge unlocks, but then at the end of the cocking stroke when the sear is reset the sledge/action locks back into battery and stays that way until I fire the shot and it unlocks properly during the firing sequence.

Pistol is a FWB65 with short barrel (what Beeman called a “MkII”), just acquired in otherwise beautiful condition. Seals appear original - white piston buffer, blue breech seal, white/translucent damper. They are in need of renewal (the piston buffer is flaking) but still basically functional. Firing sequence is very smooth.

A friend’s FWB80 also behaves this way.

I have two others, an FWB65 regular length and an FWB80, that don’t do this. On those, if I move the action back into battery after firing it then stays locked during the full cocking sequence. (The FWB65 with a regular length barrel, I successfully renewed myself - new damper, breech seal, piston buffer, piston ring/seal, mainspring. That was a fun adventure!)

Just curious what others’ experience is.

Steyr LP50 is wonderful, these old FWBs are neat too. Quiet, soothing to shoot, and I don’t mind the emphasis on follow through.

[Gwhite]

You shouldn't have to manually move the action forward, it's normally reset during the cocking process. I don't know if the feature is broken or worn out, but if it works, you may be confusing the mechanism by manually doing its job.

[kevinweiho]

Question for the Feinwerkbau cognescenti -

Is it normal, or within range of normal function, for the sledge/action to intermittently unlock during the cocking sequence?

For example - after firing, I nudge the sledge/action forward so it locks in battery, then pull the cocking lever back to cock and reload. When the cocking lever is near the 90 degree mark (perpendicular to the bore) the often sledge unlocks, but then at the end of the cocking stroke when the sear is reset the sledge/action locks back into battery and stays that way until I fire the shot and it unlocks properly during the firing sequence.

Pistol is a FWB65 with short barrel (what Beeman called a “MkII”), just acquired in otherwise beautiful condition. Seals appear original - white piston buffer, blue breech seal, white/translucent damper. They are in need of renewal (the piston buffer is flaking) but still basically functional. Firing sequence is very smooth.

I have a FWB 80. When I bought it used, it also had the same issue you mentioned. Your seals are the original seals, when those seals becomes gummy/brittle and falling apart, it's time to replace them.

If you look closely, the piston damper/buffer, applies pressure to a small tab up front when closing the breech. I assume the seal is worn and not making enough contact with the tab.

After each firing, it unlatches, raising the pistol slightly downwards latches it again, no need to nudge the sledge.

[BarrelRider]

Gwhite,

Come again?

Which part of the recocking process are you thinking of? Are you saying that you cock it with the action unlocked (back, out of battery) and then the last part of the cocking lever arc not only resets the sear and locks the piston back but also moves the action forward into battery and locks it there?

After firing I can hold it horizontal and nudge it forward into battery, or simply angle it downward and weight of the action will slide it into battery. Then cock it. (Isn’t that what most competitors do? Fire, lower the arm to angle the pistol downwards off target which incidentally with FWB65/80/90 will enable gravity to pull the action forward into battery, then cock & load for a new shot cycle?)

Plus we store these uncocked, in battery (sledge/action forward & locked), so for that first shot at least, cocking begins with the action locked in battery (sledge forward).

Post #7 in this thread describes behavior I’m seeing (different person, different words). https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/yellow/ ... 37931.html

[BarrelRider]

KevinW,

Yes, I have a new seal kit in hand and am looking forward to opening the gun up. Foest.eu has been a good source for seal kits.

So your experience was that you first received your used FWB80 it was unlocking abruptly during cocking then locking again at the end of the cocking stroke, but that unlocking behavior went away after you had the breech seal, piston buffer, and damper (small polymer piece on the cylinder face that pushes the tab in the breech) replaced? With those new parts, the sledge/action stayed in battery during the cocking stroke?

Interesting, thank you.

As I understand it, that tab has two functions - to enable/disable the bear trap ratchet, and block the sear. (After firing when you open the breech, you will see that the tab is forward - in this position a slot in the tab body allows the bear trap ratchet to engage with notches in the outside of the cylinder. Then at the end of the cocking stroke the sear is reset, and the tab moves back under spring tension - when the sear moves to reset, the other end of the tab piece slides behind the sear and blocks it so it cannot release. Backward movement of the tab also slides the forward edge of the slot in the tab body back to fold the bear trap ratchet away from the cylinder and allow the cylinder to return forward and close the breech. Finally the “damper” on the front of cylinder pushes the tab forward again as the cylinder locks closed, pulling the other end of the tab piece from behind the sear, unblocking the sear to enable the shot to be fired).

[kevinweiho]

KevinW,

Yes, I have a new seal kit in hand and am looking forward to opening the gun up. Foest.eu has been a good source for seal kits.

So your experience was that you first received your used FWB80 it was unlocking abruptly during cocking then locking again at the end of the cocking stroke, but that unlocking behavior went away after you had the breech seal, piston buffer, and damper (small polymer piece on the cylinder face that pushes the tab in the breech) replaced? With those new parts, the sledge/action stayed in battery during the cocking stroke?

Interesting, thank you.

Yup, I changed all the seals and the unlocking behavior went away. I also cleaned and slightly lubed the rails of the sledge with FWB "special" grease.

When you change all the seals, you may feel closing the breech a bit difficult, with use, the new seals will break in.

[Gwhite]

I was mostly remembering from having spent my youth shooting a FWB 150 rifle, which I thought had pretty much the same mechanism. When you pull back on the cocking lever, the action moved forward automatically, and locked. I shot a 65 a lot less, and it was over 50 years ago, so I could easily be misremembering. With the rifle, you typically tilt it up while cocking & loading. With the pistol, you'd point it down & maybe gravity takes care of it. Basically, I have no memory of having to manually reposition the action after each shot.

[ojh2]

I have one FWB 65 and two 80s. For me they are mostly collector pieces, haven't shot them that much but AFAIK they are in good shape internally. I just fired a few shots with all three. None required any deliberate manipulation of the upper. Just pull the cocking lever back, load a pellet, push lever forward, fire. Repeat. If after firing the gun was level or pointed up, during the backstroke of the lever the upper moved and locked into its forward position. If the gun was pointed down, the upper sled forward and stayed there during the whole loading process.

I am quite sure the pistol is intented to be used without manipulating the upper separately from the cocking lever. Neither does the 65/80 manual mention anything about some need to fiddle with the upper.